This week famed UFO investigator and New York Times reporter Leslie Kean arrives for a wide-ranging discussion about everything from her amazing book about the afterlife to the May 15  New York Times article on US Navy UFO encounters over the Atlantic. Having been friends for of 20 years, Whitley and Leslie have an intimate and wide-ranging discussion that covers everything from Leslie’s reporting on the afterlife to her insights into official secrecy to previously unpublished information about the Pilot Hazard Reports that were the subject of the May Times article, which she has on her desk as they discuss them.

Do not miss this extraordinary edition of Dreamland!

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    1. Author

      Thanks for this,Doug, and for the thoughtful interview.

  1. In this episode of Dreamland, two biological questions are raised: 1) The moment of death … what is it like? Biologically, humans near death begin a breathing pattern known as Cheyne-Stokes breathing, which is irregular. Cheyne-Stokes breathing occurs only twice in each person’s lifetime, once when they are born, and then also as they approach death. Here is a link with more information:

    2) What is the purpose of cattle mutilation? My suggestion is to look for common patterns in the tissues removed. For example, if digestive organs and blood are most commonly removed, that suggests that such visitors may be wanting to collect information on how mammals absorb nutrition, and what those nutrition sources are. Digestive organs and blood also contain a lot of glandular tissue and hormonal chemicals, so perhaps endocrine functions are also being studied.

  2. In a way the process of becoming aware of Who we are in truth beyond this virtual reality suit we are wearing is the extinction of who we so far have believed we are.
    We are the second coming. New beings in a new world. It has been called the resurrection. For not experiencing Who you really are is like being dead. And worse if who you experience being is a being that is in many aspects the opposite of Who you really are, when your real Identity is infinitely great intelligent, wise, creative pure Love power…

    Who else but such a Being would feel dissatisfied with whom It experiences being as a human, and miss being Itself?
    No one else.
    We have been invited to deny ourselves -to no longer identify with who and how we seem to be as humans- so Who our the Self is may elevate us to Itself. That our self be elevated to our Self.
    Just as the child we once experienced being is no longer there when we experience being a grown up, and in that sense the child we once experienced being is “dead” and “extinct”, so is the extinction of the human race once it is elevated to its Divinity. Not that we won’t be appearing here still in human form. But the reality we experience is then completely different and in that sense completely new.
    The invitation has been given us. It is left up to us to accept it or refuse it. We may postpone it, and even never accept it, but then we will be given the invitation again after we have left the body behind in this world.
    It is wisest to not postpone it -even thought there is no judgement against us when we do- as we have the Divine right to end the experience of suffering while still experiencing being in this world. We may choose joy instead, for that is what we are being invited to. And we don’t have to physically die for that.
    That already gives a tiny glimpse in the new world, a reality we have never known before as humans.
    Nothing we love and is useful to us and makes us happy will be lost.

  3. Just as in dreams, everything in this virtual reality is a symbolic pointer to the reality beyond it.
    So as pointers to the other reality that is our original home which we want to bring here -as in bringing heaven on earth- many reports appear when we use as search terms on the Internet: commercial airline pilots reporting ufos
    And: military pilots reporting ufos
    Including the NY Times articles will show up.
    Just as there are crop circles made by humans, there are many more that are not made by humans. The same goes for UFOs made by the military.
    Humans in those cases are imitating what our true Self is creating.
    The circle symbolizes infinity as it has no beginning and no end.
    The square made by four connected dots and connecting lines symbolizes manifestation: three dots form a flat triangle. When we place a fourth dot above it and connect the dots with lines we have a tetrahedron: the first manifestation in 3D.
    Of course we also have the three dimensions of space, and the dimension of time.
    But infinity embraces it all, and is in all, even though the forms it takes on are temporary and changing.
    The infinite in essence doesn’t change, but by extending itself into this reality it becomes aware of itself where it was not aware of itself before.

  4. In many among us the old program still runs prescribing that as humans we don’t deserve to even think of allowing ourselves the awareness that we might be anything more than just that: severely flawed imperfect creatures. Let alone that the recognition of our divine spiritual being in union with the Creator would be due us.
    It would indeed not be due us if we were but these human beings. But as the Creator is due His Self knowledge, so He is due that in us.
    After all it is the Creator Who -under the impression and the belief He is but a human- still thinks He is not worthy of such a lofty Self-recognition in those among us who resist such a recognition. Which among other things expresses itself as denying the existence of Extra Terrestrial (non-earthly) life and everything related to it.
    The old program says it is an insult to the Creator to assume He is appearing here now in what seems to be but our human appearance.
    The Creator is not aware yet of Himself in all of us at this moment of writing. But He is working hard on it in each one of us. Consciously or unconsciously. For He wants for us that we have the same great happiness He enjoys. A happiness but the Creator can have. Which is precisely why He is appearing here now disguised as each one of us.
    It is Divine Love that is the glue that hold everything together.

  5. I’ve been watching a movie on Amazon Prime about the experiences of Charles James Hall out in Navada, called “Walking with the Tall Whites” and at the end he is asked to comment on the relatively recent ‘tic-tac’ UFO footage. As far as he is concerned, they are perfectly legitimate and contain what he refers to as one of the Tall Whites’ ‘Scoutships’. The ‘Millenial Hospitality’ series of books are about his experiences out there, where he apparently interacts with many of the Whites, including their children and sees their small ships at close quarters. Although I haven’t read any of them, the story certainly intrigues me.

  6. Such a thoughtful interview—two old friends letting us listen to their questioning conversation. The language of sacred geometric symbols rang my bell.

  7. At the moment of death I believe the spirit (whatever that may be) have the ability and/or permission to travel the earth to take care of unfinished business. Let me give two examples. The first, my mother died unexpectedly from a terminal cancer that she decided to keep from everyone in the family. I was at college in the student bookstore killing some time looking at magazines (one happened to be a Playboy). A voice, and I do mean a voice rang out in my head saying; “ you don’t want to buy that magazine on the day that your mother died”. During my next class I was notified by campus security of my mothers passing.

    The second incident happened years latter. I had moved back in with my dad because he was receiving treatments for Non-Hodgkin Lymphoma. He would walk past a woman’s house each night whom herself was dying from cancer. Due to her health situation as well as my fathers I would sweep the tree droppings from her sidewalk each night. On the night of her death she appeared to me as a ghost as I watched Monday Night Football. She stood in the doorway of the den, thanked me for being the only one who cared and then just faded into the ether.

    1. Author

      In the minutes after Anne died, I found a book lying open on a bookshelf in our office. Nobody in the house had opened it. It was “Physics from Fisher Information” opened to a specific page about the idea that the universe was created as a response to a “single, primordial quest for knowledge.” Anne and I knew a similar story which we got from a very famous surgeon, of how he had understood what has become one of the world’s most important and lifesaving surgeries as he lay in a hospital in a health crisis of his own, and the spirit of the woman in the next room, who had just in that moment died, came in and gave him in her own passing out of this life the key to the understanding of his surgery. (These stories are in Afterlife Revolution.) So I agree that these last moments must happen. There must be a shadow line between life and death that we pass through, and sometimes leave something behind.

  8. This is an interesting short video:
    “People Communicate With Strange Alien Figures On Board UFO | Close Encounters”
    More clips like that:
    “Close Encounters”
    Also an amazing amount of vdeos appear by searching for “alien abductions”
    To me in this virtual reality it is all symbolism pointing at the abduction of us by the real “aliens” which are the human beings we seem to be.

    1. The sighting by Fr. Gill (cool video BTW) is significant to me because of the communication by the aliens to the observers.

      Notably the fact that they were seen on top of the object. This detail reminds me of the event that was filmed by Dr. Roger Leir off the coast of Turkey.

      The beings in the video were observed to be on top of the craft on a warm night in beautiful weather. Why not? I would love to be cruising down the coast on my ‘Magic Carpet Ride’!

  9. A very wonderful, intellegent, and insightful interview. Thank You.

    The second part for subscribers was especially deep and meaningful.

  10. Whitley, have you ever considered THANKING YOUR LUCY STARS that Peter Levenda is keeping his distance/doing you a GREAT favor? The Peter Levenda you knew of the past might not be the same Peter Levenda since aligning himself with Tom DeLonge. ‘To The Stars Academy.’ 

    1. Author

      This is a good take. Obviously, something is terribly wrong there. I do regret the loss of a wonderful friend, who was also among the most brilliant people I have ever known. I will never understand how the author of Sinister Forces could apparently join them, if that is what has happened. I know that a lot of people consider Tom DeLonge quite a negative presence, but I’m not so sure. I’d prefer to see more of what he and TTSA do before I pass judgement on their efforts.

  11. i enjoyed this very much. I was interested in the brief debate on whether we are going extinct. Leslie thinks we might be, Whitley disagreed. I think we are for three reasons. First, in dealing with climate change we are like the famous boiled frog – by the time it realises the water is boiling, it is cooked. Second, I am profoundly depressed by the behaviour of the media and politicians over Covid-19. People just haven’t come together to solve it. If we can’t solve Covid-how can we solve something bigger like climate change or another virus. Third, I have twice had brief but clear visions of a world without humans. Seemed to get along just fine.

  12. OMG, what a spectacular show!

    Leslie Kean is magnificent as always. Your guys dialog is so insightful that I could type until my fingers bleed, ha-ha.

    Thank you both for a wonderfully head-spinning interview.

    Whitley, with content like this you are at the top of your game!!!

  13. Speaking of ‘squaring the circle’, that is the formula for determining Pi.
    Yes, there may be a message…

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