The Nazca mummies recently received a huge amount of publicity when Jaime Maussan presented his version of the story before the Mexican Congress. The weaknesses in this story immediately became an international news sensation. The New York Times picked it up and revealed that a paper has been published discussing the truth about the mummies that Maussan displayed: they are a strange mix of various animal parts, very cleverly constructed–but at least a thousand years ago! Maussan claimed that they were “alien bodies.” US Navy pilot Ryan Graves, who has testified before congress about his own UAP sightings, expressed himself as being “deeply disappointed” by Maussan’s “stunt.”

There is a much bigger story here, and in this special edition of Dreamland, Whitley goes into it with William Galison who, with Theirry Jamin, has been working on the case since 2018. (Whitley has been involved since 2019.) The case has been kept relatively quiet in the interest of completing scientific work on the artifacts.

In this interview, William lays out the history of the Peru project and explains the truth about this world-class mystery. The mummies that Jaime showed are NOT aliens bodies. They are something created a thousand years ago for unknown reasons. But there are other, larger ones that Maussan could not obtain from Peru, which have revealed strange DNA results and anatomy that, under CT scans, does appear to be truly anomalous.

Go deep into what is quite possibly the greatest mystery in modern–or ancient–history with Whitley and William, who are both up on the very latest information from the REAL story.

Visit Theirry Jamin’s alien project website here. Read the scientific paper referred to in the show and the New York Times article here.


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  1. The discussion about the distinction between the small mummies and the large ones brings another dimension to it…I watched the hearing when subtitles were available, and one of the people who talked after Jaime said, specifically, that the small mummies weren’t real, and that the large mummies were the ones that they took DNA from. I didn’t make the connection that the mummies he said were fake were the ones that Jaime put out there….surely he must have known that they were fake, then? If so, why exactly would he have put things he knew were fake out there?

    *something else–I looked on Wikipedia and it says that Osmium is a contaminant in copper and nickel mining, which means that the Osmium could have naturally been present by accident, instead of intentionally.

    1. Author

      The osmium is too pure and the emblems are embedded into the skin of the chest, with tissue growing around it. Somebody chose to create this strange inclusion into the body, and did so while it was a living person. Just another level of extreme strangeness to consider along with the fact that, while the small mummies are constructions and were never living beings, they are also around a thousand years old. One is left with a great big “what the heck is all this?” That’s where we are right now.

  2. For me, this interview is mind-boggling. Thank you William Galison for taking time out from Rosh Hashanah for this interview. One of the comments on the video side ask the question, …..WHY DIDN’T YOU COVER THE EGGS????? I am curious about that as well.

  3. Author

    The eggs are 1000 years old, at least, and inside the uterus of a mummy. Therefore there is no access to them, and a fair probability that there is no reason to cover them. We would very much like a scan that would be able to see inside them.

    1. Interesting and necessary interview. It definitely seems the culture that prepared those mummies was trying to emulate something. Are they aliens? That seems clearly no.

  4. I’ve been following this since the discoveries of 2017, and have been firmly on the fence. Before that, I looked into Lloyd Pye and the ‘Star Child’ skull. (Before he passed, I communicated with him, as well). The ‘Star Child’ was determined to be human in 2003, although there was an abnormal skull (possibly hydrocephalic?), and the child had been buried with a normal-appearing human woman—who was not his mother (the two were totally different haplo groups.) Pye’s assertion was that the child may have been an alien-human hybrid. DNA testing has come a long way since 2003, so I would be curious if more information could be gleaned with up-to-date DNA testing (where is the skull now?). Also, if hybridization had been going on for thousands of years, would we recognize it in the DNA?

    This is all so fascinating! As usual, it seems like Maussan’s ‘aliens’ could be a huge part of the story as both a distraction from the mummies in Peru, as well as a separate story themselves. To make things stranger still, when the Nazca lines were mentioned briefly, I got that deja vu thing…Whitley, I may send you more on this…it’s a little far out, and may mean nothing to anyone, except me. Suffice to say that there was a lot of food for thought…

  5. Interesting and necessary interview. It definitely seems the culture that prepared those mummies was trying to emulate something. Are they aliens? That seems clearly no.

  6. Author

    I think that it is quite possible that they are an earthly species, perhaps one that was already struggling then, and has nearly died out by now. Or perhaps a mix – a sort of colony— from somewhere else in part, and in part from here.

    It is so important at this juncture to keep the question open.

    1. That is very possible…There is a very old Hopi legend of ‘Ant People’, which I have always found intriguing.

      The legend, states that the these Ant People were saviors of the Hopi, taking them underground and teaching them how to survive extreme cataclysms.

      The Hopi survived underground with the Ant People, and the ancestors learned how to grow food with little water and build dwellings in the rocks. They also learned about the stars and mathematics, and how to build complex structures like those at Chaco Canyon for when they returned to the surface.

      It could just be a legend, or something more.

    2. Do the small mummies look like what you imagine small greys would look like if they were mummified? Do greys have 3 fingers and not 4?

  7. The question has been open for a long time, as it should be. The information on all of this has really grown since 2017. I highly recommend that everyone go to the links provided and read them thoroughly. If you are put off by the science, don’t be. If nothing else, view the scans and photos of the ‘beings’, to get an idea of what has, or has not been found. Here are some more links that may make it easier for everyone, and hopefully less intimidating:

    Also, for those curious about Josefina’s ‘eggs’ go here:

  8. After reading independently written books on the Hopi people, I don’t view the Hopi reports on the Ant people as legends, but strictly true … almost incomprehensible, but true. It may be the Ant people that made it possible for the Hopi to be the first people in North America by a long shot.

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